Editing Talk:Szeth

== Move to Szeth-son-son-Vallano ==

The naming convention among the Shin includes their fathers' name and we haven't seen a hint of using surnames. Since we use full names in all character articles, I think we should move this to Szeth's full name as well, Szeth-son-son-Vallano, and Neturo to Neturo-son-Vallano. Right now, we have 3 Shin with full names, and 3 with only first names (though we don't know the full name of Vallano)--[[User:Cem|Cem]] ([[User talk:Cem|talk]]) 07:49, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

: We could do with more opinion on this, I think my gut reaction would be to put Shin on just their first name, but I could be wrong. --[[User:Fbstj|Joe ST]] ([[User talk:Fbstj|talk]]) 08:33, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

::My gut also leans to keeping it Szeth, but I don't have any good rationalization for this. I am curious to hear other's thoughts as well. -- [[User:Chaos2651|Chaos2651]] ([[User talk:Chaos2651|talk]]) 09:11, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

If we do end up keeping it Szeth, we might also consider naming all Shin articles by their first name, for uniformity's sake. Maybe that's just my mild OCD speaking, but I'm a sucker for standardization. --[[User:Cem|Cem]] ([[User talk:Cem|talk]]) 09:45, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

: That's my opinion, I think they should all be on just their first name, but I can also see the reasoning behind the longer names...with maybe Szeth being the only exception (similar to Vin)? --[[User:Fbstj|Joe ST]] ([[User talk:Fbstj|talk]]) 09:49, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

::I can't say I agree with Szeth being an exception. I wasn't around when the decision for Vin was made, but I can see the reasoning behind it. She didn't marry Elend until late in the series, and I'm willing to bet that not many people think of her as "Vin Venture". Whereas Szeth has been Szeth-son-son-Vallano from the start of tWoK, that's the first word of the prologue in fact.--[[User:Cem|Cem]] ([[User talk:Cem|talk]]) 10:18, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

:I definitely agree with moving Szeth to Szeth-son-son-Vallano because that is his name. Just "Szeth" is ''not''.  It isn't proper, we should be using a person's full, proper name.  Vin I'm fine with because she identifies more with her skaa heritage and skaa don't appear to use surnames.  But Szeth is a different situation, he is introduced in the prologue as Szeth-son-son-Vallano.--[[User:WeiryWriter|WeiryWriter]] ([[User talk:WeiryWriter|talk]]) 17:18, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

::Is discussion page necro a thing? I agree with WeiryWriter on this. It's there a reason ''not to''? --[[User:Jofwu|Jofwu]] ([[User talk:Jofwu|talk]]) 01:07, 7 January 2017 (MST)

: Is he still identifying as son-son? --[[User:Fbstj|Joe ST]] ([[User talk:Fbstj|talk]]) 02:33, 7 January 2017 (MST)

As of ''Oathbringer'', Szeth no longer identifies himself as Szeth-son-son-Vallano or Szeth-son-Neturo. He's gone through several names recently, including "just Szeth", "Szeth of Shinovar", "Szeth of the Skybreakers" and "Szeth-son-Honor". My personal opinion is that we wait until book five to move Szeth's page to Szeth-son-Honor, as it will likely indicate whether "Szeth-son-Honor" is his full name, much as RoW indicated that Stormblessed is in fact now Kaladin's house name. Or we could ask Brandon. In any case, I'd prefer the page stay where it is for now. --[[User:Extremepayne|Extremepayne]] ([[User talk:Extremepayne|talk]]) 16:08, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

:I currently strongly disagree with moving to Szeth-son-Honor. -- [[User:Chaos2651|Chaos2651]] ([[User talk:Chaos2651|talk]]) 18:12, 23 November 2020 (UTC)

== Szeth Master's ==
Became Truthless

The Shin    - SA1, I-4

Vstim       - SA1, I-4

???         - SA1, I-4

Liss        - SA2, Prologue

???         - SA2, Prologue

Parshendi   - SA1, Prologue

Avado       - SA1, I-3

???         - SA1, I-3

Took        - SA1, I-3

Makkek      - SA1, I-3 

Taravangian - SA1, I-3

Released

This was all made by head, and checking the wiki. I didn't check the books. So I'm not 100% that this is correct. So if someone wants to check this and then add it to the main page, go for it.

== Status as Truthless ==

In Words of Radiance, I-14, Taravangian's thoughts tell us that "Szeth had been banished from Shinovar, made Truthless for something relating to a claim that the Voidbringers had returned. If he discovered that he wasn't wrong about that claim, then what --". The thought is interrupted,but it may have some bearing on why and how Szeth became Truthless and the natured rules governing being Truthless. I see nothing yet I. The wiki that explains why Szeth was made Truthless and banished.
:So add what you found. :) -[[User:Jofwu|Jofwu]] ([[User talk:Jofwu|talk]]) 01:03, 7 January 2017 (MST)

== Cognitive Shadow/Invested Entity ==

In RoW, Vasher describes a Type I Invested Entity as someone who died, but had their soul stapled back onto a body--maybe even their own. Szeth was killed by Kaladin, but Nale managed to use Regrowth to put him back right before he went into the Beyond. Should Cognitive Shadow be under his abilities?<br/>
-[[User:Spriy|Spriy]] ([[User_talk:Spriy|talk]]), 14:03, 15 June 2021 (UTC)
@@ Line 61: / Line 61: @@
 In RoW, Vasher describes a Type I Invested Entity as someone who died, but had their soul stapled back onto a body--maybe even their own. Szeth was killed by Kaladin, but Nale managed to use Regrowth to put him back right before he went into the Beyond. Should Cognitive Shadow be under his abilities?<br/>
 -[[User:Spriy|Spriy]] ([[User_talk:Spriy|talk]]), 14:03, 15 June 2021 (UTC)
-:Good question, but I'd say no. In [[wob:5995]], Brandon says Szeth is not a Cognitive Shadow and while one could read that chapter of RoW as superseding that WoB, I don't think it's a clear enough to concretely establish that Szeth ''is'' a Cognitive Shadow; it's also possible that Vasher doesn't completely understand what happened with Szeth.
-:--[[User:Stargazer|Stargazer]] ([[User talk:Stargazer|talk]]) 15:36, 15 June 2021 (UTC)